Let Scripture Interpret Scripture: Joel’s Army Teaching Debunked

Of all the false teaching that is out there nowadays, perhaps none is more dangerous than the idea of Joel’s Army; the belief that God is raising up a group of hardcore believers to purge the Church of all who resist their doctrines, and then to conquer the world for Christ (by force). My friends jokingly refer to this as “Islamic Christianity”. Given the danger posed by this teaching, I set out to find a few ways to prove it false. Come, let us reason together…

 

Dominionist Teaching Clearly Defies New Testament Principles

 

Jesus left no doubt in His teaching that His Kingdom was not to be won by force. When Peter fought to prevent Jesus’ arrest, he was rebuked sharply, and Jesus even healed Peter’s victim (John 18). Jesus later told Pilate in John 18:36, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place.” The whole counsel of the Gospels shows this parity of thought; the Jews ultimate rejection of Christ as Messiah came because they thought Messiah would be a military leader that would overthrow the Romans. In John 6, the people tried to make Jesus king by force. Why? Because they thought He was there to restore their sovereignty to them! Dominionists like to quote Jesus’ saying, “The Kingdom of Heaven suffers violence, and violent men take it by force”, as a call to arms. While this is a rather enigmatic passage, it would seem to me a more responsible conjecture that Jesus is referring to the Jews who tried to force him to set up the Kingdom Now. After all, one of the indicators of the Beast is, “He will speak against the Most High and oppress his saints and try to change the set times and the laws” (Daniel 7:25a).

 

The Early Church Demonstrated Total Pacifism

 

The testimony of the early church also serves to show the pattern learned and passed down by the original disciples. The writings of men like Justin Martyr, Clement of Alexandria, Origen and others tell us some very interesting things about church doctrine over the first 200 years of the Church*:

 

• Christians were expected to abstain from military service, since they considered killing in combat just as murderous as killing for profit. When it is considered that men in the military are paid for their work, this is no real leap of logic: they are paid killers.
• Christians would not report anyone for a capital offense, since they considered doing so complicit with murder. Even though they weren’t the executioner, they felt that getting someone arrested when they knew it would result in their death was tantamount to executing them themselves
• Christians were taught to stay away from the arenas, because it was unbecoming Christians to watch someone be killed, even if they were a convicted criminal

 

This is a far cry from the Christianity we have inherited, which is more supportive of military action and the death penalty than is secular culture. Aside from all of these, let us briefly consider mere common sense: If God wanted Christians to conquer the world by force, why wouldn’t He have had the Church do so at any point in the last 2000 years? Christianity became the official state religion of Rome in the 300’s. How easy would it have been for the Roman armies, already in control of half the known world, to complete their conquest with God on their side? Yet we see just the opposite; this time period marked the beginning of the fall of Rome.

 

Joel 2 interpreted by Ezekiel

 

Dominionists believe that the great army in Joel 2 is an army of Christians sent to conquer the world. To support this, they quote verse 11: “The LORD thunders at the head of his army; his forces are beyond number, and mighty are those who obey his command.” I suppose they reason that, since God is at the head of the army, it must be an army of Christians. Such thinking, however, neglects the fact that in the Old Testament, God used “secular” cultures to judge Israel (Babylon, e.g.). However, let us leave conjecture and move to firm exegesis. We’ll start by using a side-by-side comparison of Joel 2 and Ezekiel 38.

 

In Joel 2, we learn:

1.      A Large and mighty army, such as never was of old…(vs. 2)

2.      They have the appearance of horses, gallop like cavalry (vs. 4)

3.      Before them the earth shakes (vs. 10)

4.      The day of the Lord is great and dreadful; who can endure it? (vs.11)

5.      Referred to as the Northern Army (vs. 20)

6.      God will deliver Israel from this army (vs. 20)

 

Compare to Ezekiel:

1.      A great horde…and the many nations with you (38:4-7); a great horde, a mighty army (38:15); You and all your troops…advancing like a storm, like a cloud covering the land (38:9)

2.      Your horses, your horsemen fully armed (38:4); all of them riding horses (38:15)

3.      At that time there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel. (38:19)

4.      All the people on the face of the earth will tremble at my presence (38:20)

5.      You will come from your place in the far north (38:15)

6.      God will deliver Israel from this army (38:21-39:6)

 

Now add to all these the fact that God says in Ezekiel that these are the things He spoke of through other prophets in “former days”, and it takes little more than common sense to conclude that the 2 passages are referring to the same event.

 

The Point?

 

If we can conclude that Joel and Ezekiel are referring to the same event, then we can combine the 2 prophecies to get a more complete picture (I’d encourage all to read both chapters at length). For example, Joel 2 leaves room for conjecture as to who this army is and what their motives are. This ambiguity leaves room for Dominionists to teach that it is an army of righteous people chosen to judge carnal saints. However, Ezekiel goes into far more detail. From his prophecy, it is clear that this army was chosen, not because they are righteous, but so that God can ultimately judge them instead of Israel when Israel turns back to Him.

 

Conclusion

 

So while we can debate the geographic location of this army, or whether or not this prophecy has been fulfilled, one thing we can be certain of: this is not about an army of believers conquering the world for Christ. And unless the Dominionists are okay with ultimately being the ones who are destroyed, as both passages clearly show, I’m not sure I’d want it to be so if I were them!

 

* All information on early church doctrine collected from Will the Real Heretics Please Stand Up? By David W. Bercot. I’m no early church scholar, so I’m quoting someone who quoted someone. Take that for what it’s worth.

I don’t normally do this…

…but this is a must-read. Please, read and let this sink in.

http://ceruleansanctum.com/2009/06/the-real-sins-of-sodom.html#comment-45025

Many Miniscule Musings and Much Alliteration

Charismatic Crackup on Law and Order:SVU

It seems the over-the-top Charismatics have finally drawn the attention of the media. The “purp” on Law and Order:SVU last night was a Charismatic. I tuned out for the most part, but the writers of the show did their homework, accurately representing spiritual warfare at it’s finest. They even mentioned “The Toronto Blessing”. The “purp” in question smothered her “demonised” child who “really only had ADHD”, and had also apparently run a cheese grater over her daughters arms for much the same reason (again, I tuned in and out). Little to say except that we can expect to see more of this focus on the crazies as time goes on, till eventually it’s made out that we’re all like that.

Fatherlessness…coming to a church near you?

I was just pondering yesterday the parallel between the epidemic of deadbeat dads in secular culture and the extremem lack of discipleship and spiritual fathers in the church. That there is a correlation is undeniable, the question is, which is cause and which is effect? I think it could be argued from both sides, but either is a shame on the church.

Feeling the Fear

Lately I’ve been feeling increasingly unsettled in my spirit. Anyone else? Insight as to what it might be? Again I have my own theories, but would rather hear others’.

Reconciliation Realized

I gave up at last and joined Facebook. I was looking through the people I went to school with, and I found someone I really didn’t get along with. Turns out, he’s a Christian now too, and a musician as well. So I sent him a message asking if he wanted to do shows with our band. I just think it’s really cool to see how God can bring together people who once heartily disliked one another and cause them to get along peacefully in His name. We made no mention of past issues, just talked like we’d always been cool. Praise God for a brother found.

Also in that vain, I found out a kid I used to be good friends with, who was at one point ensnared by heroin among other things, is also now a Christian. He’s clean now and runs his own contracting business. Awesome to see whom God chose from among us!

Blind Eyes Within and Open Ones Without?

I had a wonderful conversation today with a young girl at work. Her and I have never really talked much about anything deep, and I had always taken her for someone that simply didn’t think very deeply. My mistake, apparently.

This young woman,  just graduating High School this week, held a long conversation with me about how our culture’s way of life is a precarious house of cards. She went into great detail about her desires to live without immenities like electricity and mass production. She lamented the fact that most people our age wouldn’t even know how to survive if such were to happen. She sees the lack of actual value in all that our culture holds dear, and sees as well how relying upon such things ultimately makes us weak.Of course I was eager to engage in this conversation, since this is something near and dear to my heart and frequently mused upon in my mind.

Here’s what gets me though: I can attribute my “wisdom” in this area to Jesus. He taught these things. The Bible warns us throughout about how meaningless most things in life are, and to not be caught up in the cares of this world. It’s so obvious throughout the Word, I can’t understand how anyone with even a cursory Biblical knowledge could fail to see it. But this girl was raised Catholic, and barely at that. She is entirely irreligious at this point. Not to say she may not know pieces about the Bible, but there’s no obvious level of devotion present, where one might expect her to hold such views.

So my question, or musing at least, is: How is it that this irreligious, 18 year old girl; girlfriend and friend of drug addicts and dealers; member of a generation that has never known anything but gross prosperity and meaninglessness; how is it that such a girl as this sees these uniquely Biblical lessons as common sense, but when I raise these issues to believers, they often look at me like I’m crazy? Have we done so poorly at learning and teaching the Gospel that unbelievers possess more spiritual wisdom than we do?

How long, O Lord, will you endure this foolishness?

A Sloppy Convergence of Battlegrounds

Lately I’ve been reflecting of the numerous battles currently going on in the American Christian community, and have been carefully observing what is now obvious as a messy confluence. It seems obvious to me that things are setting up for “the perfect storm”, and I thought I’d lay it all out here as I see it, in case it interests anyone else.

The “Church” vs. Culture

James Dobson recently stated that the culture war is lost. And well it should be, as we had no right to engage in a culture war in the first place. If even God’s perfect law can bring only death in sinful men, how is it that the laws of men can bring anything less to the unbelieving? However, I disagree with his assesment. It is obvious that the battle’s loss is an inevitability, true. But the defeat has yet to be handed to us. We’re at the point where we’ve just realized we’re a tee ball team that stepped onto the field against the Phillies, but the game has only just begun. Our butts have yet to be whooped in the way they will. When those who have come to hate us because of the un-Christ-like behavior of our “brothers” engaged in the culture war realize what we are now realizing, the persecution will come like a flood. Hang onto your seats, folks. The show’s just starting.

Good Doctrine vs. Bad Doctrine

Go ahead, I know. I’m a legalist, right? No, I just have a passion to see God’s word used (only) as He intended it to be. And many others like me are out there, and they’re starting to get angry. Rick Joyner’s prophecied civil war in the church, which he so thirstily awaits, is heating up. This past week, it was reported that Matt Sorger became the latest to seemingly cross enemy lines and join the ranks of those crying out for discernment. He now joins a list which includes, to varying degrees, Robert Riccardelli (sp?), Andrew Strom, and Lee Grady. More and more Charismatics are waking up to the fact that, in their thirst for an encounter with God, they have opened the door to any and all manner of weirdness and heresy that calls itself such. This wouldn’t be as big a problem were it not for…

Dominionists vs. Everyone that stands in their way

Most of the aforementioned false prophets and teachers believe they are called by God to purge the Church of all who disagree with their theology, and then conquer the world for Christ. Literally. By force. They’re not kidding. Thus, on top of the persecution all Christians will encounter from secular culture, we’re also headed towards some Christians being persecuted by others, and possibly the Domionists making a move towards insurrection on a government level as well.

So what does this all mean? Many would state, and I agree, the collapse of the American church as we know it, and happily so. What will rise from the ashes of this mess will be a greatly reduced, but purified, Church. However, the point I want to make is just how messy and chaotic it’s shaping up to be. It’s time to wake up, people! This is a bad time to be sleeping. This blaise American attitude that we have taken towards spiritual matters will not suffice any longer. This all is really happening! Please, prepare yourselves.

New Song – Your Way

Since I’m starting to get back into music, I thought I’d give a foretaste of the lyrics I’ve been writing. My newer songs are addressed directly at Christians first and foremost, not the world. Feel free to critique and comment. Note: I have studied plagarism laws, and posting on this blog will prove de facto copyright in the event of any discrepancies. Please contact me before using this material in any way.

I was your enemy, I hated every word you spoke

My every word and action bent on raging against truth

I slandered you so viciously, you should have destroyed me

It makes me sick to think about all that I had done

But it’s this that makes me see

How loving you can be

Cuz when I thumbed my nose so flagrantly

It was then that you died to save me

 

I was so broken, pathetic mess of twisted flesh

No hope of ever leaving the life that I’d been leading

I’d dug myself a hole so deep that all I ever did was sleep

Cuz only then could I escape the truth

But its this that makes me see

How patient you can be

Cuz when I couldn’t stand on my own feet

It was then that you carried me

 

And I just wanted you to know

That wherever this life goes

I will never forget the day

That I first beheld your face

And I could never hope to repay

All the things you’ve done for me

But I just have to say

I wanna live my life your way

 

And even now, although I know your ways

All these years along, I still keep dropping the ball

I fall so hard and go astray, how high above me are your ways

And then like Adam I go run and hide

But its this that makes me see

How gentle you can be

No sooner am I down on my knees

Than you rush in to cover me

 

And I just wanted you to know

That wherever this life goes

I will never forget the day

That I first beheld your face

And I could never hope to repay

All the things you’ve done for me

But I just have to say

I wanna live my life your way

New Song – Enough is Enough

Since I’m starting to get back into music, I thought I’d give a foretaste of the lyrics I’ve been writing. My newer songs are addressed directly at Christians first and foremost, not the world. Feel free to critique and comment. Note: I have studied plagarism laws, and posting on this blog will prove de facto copyright in the event of any discrepancies. Please contact me before using this material in any way.

Preaching war when God says peace

Servants of the Lamb you fleece

(Blind lead blind, dull your mind)

Pervert the Word that you expound

And on your lips no truth is found

(You’re profane, or insane)

My Father’s House will be called a house of prayer

Unless of course you’re the one who speaks there

Your tongue is forked and your throat is an open grave

There is no profit in a Prophet who’s depraved

 

We don’t want to hear your lies anymore

We just want to live what Christ died for

 

The Church, His Bride, being conformed to Him

Not walking in the ways of madmen’s whims

 

Preaching hate when God says love

Words betray the heart they come from

(Cold as ice, black as night)

Slander those who dare oppose

Your rhetoric and deceptive prose

(Hypocrisy, of the highest degree)

Those who speak the truth have naught to fear

When honest scrutiny is brought to bear

But anger is the response of a liar trapped

By the truth in front and his words at his back

 

We don’t want to hear your lies anymore

We just want to live what Christ died for

Believers separated unto Him

Not walking in the ways of madmen’s whims

 

This one is no where near finished yet. This is just 2 verses and a chorus, but it gives an idea of where it’s going. Let me know what you think.

New Song – mIndless

Since I’m starting to get back into music, I thought I’d give a foretaste of the lyrics I’ve been writing. My newer songs are addressed directly at Christians first and foremost, not the world. Feel free to critique and comment. Note: I have studied plagarism laws, and posting on this blog will prove de facto copyright in the event of any discrepancies. Please contact me before using this material in any way.

Sit in front of your tv’s, hours slipping away

Never stop to wonder what your life has meant today

Mindless entertainment meant to keep you occupied

Day by day you still can’t say it leaves you satisfied

 

Don’t you ever wonder

If this is really all there is?

 

Sit in bed with your computer, hours slipping away

Losing sleep and sinking deep into depravity

Attainment of your ever-growing appetite denied

The endless quest for perfect flesh won’t leave you satisfied

 

Don’t you ever wonder

If this is really all there is?

 

They sell you flesh, they sell you scandal

You feast your eyes upon their lies, reality dismantled

They sell you drugs and tragedy

They rob your life of meaning and you don’t even see

 

We’ve grown too rich for our own good, lost sight of what is real

Live our lives from high to high, just so we can feel

Doesn’t anybody else see the things I see?

This vile lie, the American Dream, it’s not reality

 

Don’t you ever wonder

If this is really all there is?

 

They sell you flesh, they sell you scandal

You feast your eyes upon their lies, reality dismantled

They sell you drugs and tragedy

They rob your life of meaning and you don’t even see

A Peculiar People

As most of you know, I’ve been dwelling a lot lately on why it is that we in the industrialized world’s churches don’t look like those in the New Testament. This post dove-tails that line of thought. Most of this is musing, but I want this to be more of a discussion than a one-sided post. Please comment with your opinions.

First, let me say that Dan Edelen at Cerulean Sanctum had some great thoughts on this topic. You can view that at http://ceruleansanctum.com/2008/11/a-nation-of-fig-trees.html . The comments section is also a good read.

That foundation laid, as well as that of my previous posts, I turn to my big question for the moment: What is it that is supposed to make the Christian a “peculiar” person to the world? See, once upon a time, I thought it was abstinence from sin. Yet as I re-examine this question, several things come to my attention. For one, I know plenty of unbelievers that don’t smoke, don’t drink, don’t swear, etc. Further, “good behavior” in itself does nothing to endear the Christian message to unbelievers…that is, if all they think we are is a people free from indulgence, what draw is there in that? I’m not saying we shouldn’t strive for purity, or that being “a little sinful” is helpful in reaching people; far from it! I’m simply saying that such, unlinked to any other factors, fails to draw the unbelieving heart, much less glorify Christ in any way.

So then I considered charity, for surely a people who value the needs of others equally to their own in a time of surpassing greed is peculiar? Turns out, not so much. Recent reports say that donations to charity in America, regardless of an individual’s creed, have stayed level despite the economic crisis. This means that even unbelievers are still giving as much to charity as they had been before, regardless of their financial situation. I understand that this trend in unbelievers may be in part due to the heavy influence of Humanism in our society, but if such anti-Christ teaching produces the same “fruit” as Christianity, then what is our testimony?

And so I considered non-proselytizing missions work, like building wells and rebuilding homes after natural disasters. Yet likewise, one will find that humanitarian work is by no means limited to the Christian. So if even unbelievers are willing to leave home and family for a time to help those in need, what then is our testimony?

I believe in writing this, God may have given me an answer, at least in part. But I would like to hear everyone else’s thoughts before I render my conclusion. If you have input along these lines, I urge you to comment. However, I respectfully request that you refrain from telling me I’m being too harsh, that everything is fine. Everything IS NOT fine! Read Acts, and then look at us. Assuredly, nothing is fine, and blind is the man who can’t see it. If you’re content with this affront to true Christianity we’re espousing, then go back to sleep with a fleeting prayer that I’m wrong. I, for one, yearn with every fiber of my being to be “legitimate”…if only I can find what that means in the midst of this facade.

Disclaimer

To my usual readers: either ignore this post, or ask me about it in person. NO COMMENTS, PLEASE.

Disclaimer to “anyone else monitoring this site”…you know who you are…

Whatever beliefs I may have espoused or seemed to espouse in the past, I am now thoroughly opposed to rebellion or armed insurrection against our government. No matter how much I may disagree, I believe in complete submission to the governing authorities, in accordance with Romans 13 and Scripture in general. I believe that any government, be they wholly democratic or wholly tyrannical, is put in place by God for a reason. As such, I equate political rebellion with rebellion against God himself. You will not even find me at protest rallies, much less leading a rebellion. Follow my posts, here and in online forums, and you will find I have advocated remaining uninvolved in the political process. I have encouraged even the most adamant advocates of armed resistance to lay down their weapons and instead pray for our government. My feelings are best summed up thus: “I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone— for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. ” (1 Timothy 2:1-2, NIV).

If I am viewed as a potential leader, understand that my leadership will only result in more submission and more peace, not less. To remove me from such a situation would be counterproductive and unneccessary.  There are plenty of people in this country actively planning armed resistance. Your efforts are better spent focusing on them; I am no threat to you.

God bless America.